Perth-WRX.com  

Go Back   Perth-WRX.com > Technical > Mechanicals
Register Diddy Kart ArticlesAll AlbumsBlogs FAQ Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Welcome to Perth-WRX, click here to register!

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 21-09-2010, 10:27 AM
Potty Training Scoobie Noobie
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Bunbury
Posts: 55
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
VETTETOREX at standard level
Default Fuel pump not Priming. No start. FIXED YAY

I love being stranded unexpectedly by our automotive friends.

When I turn the key the fuel pump will not prime and no start.

I have done a fair amount of searching and here's where I am at. Any help would be greatly appreciated.

I had no voltage when I checked for 12V on on the fuel pump harness when key is turned. Top right wire is correct I assume. (Black with red stripe)
So I'm ruling my fuel pump out at this stage.


I then tried to get to the relays under the dash. Quite a mission.


When I turn the key the blue one clicks and 12 volts relays through it and I have swapped relays over and they both work on the blue harness. So the relays themselves appear to be working fine. I'm assuming blue is the fuel pump relay. My searches led me to believe the MY00 fuel relay had a green harness and was mounted on top above a brown main relay and another silver round relay. (So I could be wrong - I just have these two mounted on side of the fuse panel))

There are so many wires in this car especially in this area and they are all strapped up and taped so I don't really want to pull it all apart tracing wires to see where they go. The wiring diagrams I have found don't appear to be relevant/accurate for my exact car (Built July 2000). I pulled the seat and assume the fuel pump power wire travels in here somewhere.


So, (again I'm assuming and could be totally wrong) my problem lies between this relay and the fuel pump harness. Possibly a fuel pump controller? I haven't been able to find this yet. (I ripped out the trim in the boot and looked down a little hole and couldn't see much.)

I hope it's not the stupid Brant. I'm ruling this out at this point because my check engine light is on (Its been in manual arming mode because previous owner pressed the 3 button too hard and it doesn't rarely work no matter how you press it and both my Master code and User code use this button.)
I've read about the dry solder problem but if the blue one is my fuel pump relay then that rules that out I hope.

Anyway I was hoping all you intelligent people could guide me and tell me what to look for, what to do next and what I'm doing wrong. If it helps I did notice a couple of weeks ago when I went to cold start the car the pump did not prime and then it did when i flipped the key again. I thought that is strange but nothing of it at the time.

Thanks for any help from a frustrated person - I am glad I wasn't in the middle of nowhere at the time.

PS: What is the Pink relay for and the single black wire plug that is in the drivers door kick panel that is unplugged. (I saw it mention in Giddyup's Alarm thread)

Last edited by VETTETOREX; 22-09-2010 at 11:14 AM. Reason: Added a bit
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 21-09-2010, 10:51 AM
Potty Training Scoobie Noobie
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: perth
Posts: 35
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
BLKGC8 at standard level
Default

Has your car got a key pad module for the brant? If so that is the first thing that i would be looking at.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 21-09-2010, 11:10 AM
Potty Training Scoobie Noobie
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Bunbury
Posts: 55
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
VETTETOREX at standard level
Default

Yes I have a keypad. But if there is power going through the relay will that rule it out?

See I'm not even 100% sure if the blue relay is for the fuel pump. I know you guys know your stuff.

Searching on other wrx forums this seems like a very common problem and it was due to many different things. I'm just trying to go through the troubleshooting stage as in many other threads they've replaced the Brant module, fuel pump, Relays and many times fixed but others still not solved. Sometimes just a short or melted harness somewhere.

I'm just trying to wrap my head around what to look for. I'm not keen on the Brant but I thought it activated the fuel pump relay after the code was put in(or key turned on in Manual arm mode)

Would a new keypad be worth trying? (How much from Subaru? Do I just unplug it from the Brant Module and plug back in? (Where is it? I removed the glovebox trim and had a feel around and it wasn't where I thought it was) I can solder and could check the dry joints but gut feeling tells me not to bother.

I hate the fact I heard Subaru charge you $50 when you tow it there to input the master code. (Luckily The dealer I bought the car off gave me the master code which has saved me twice)

I prefer to do things myself and learn even if it takes longer than just tow the car to Subaru.

I'm sure with a bit of time I'll sort it with Perth WRX forum help.

PS: reading things like this scares me.(From another forum)

After subaru had a look, Brad/Adam from Subaru service penrith called and said that my recall had been done years ago, and the problem was most likely to be a faulty keypad module... which will cost $660 to fix.

Here were my other options and their qoutes from subaru:
1. Disconnect the immobiliser, $370
2. Disconnect the immobiliser and alarm $470
3. Remove the whole security system $650

Last edited by VETTETOREX; 21-09-2010 at 11:17 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 21-09-2010, 11:17 AM
Rossco's Avatar
Perth WRX Old Skool Cool Dude
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Perf, NOR
Posts: 5,467
Blog Entries: 11
Thanks: 54
Thanked 100 Times in 79 Posts
Rossco is a guruRossco is a guru
Send a message via MSN to Rossco
Default

The Brant module has on-board relays that fail. you can replace them yourself if you're savvy with a soldering iron.

The relay is inbetween the ecu & the fuel pump relay in a circuitry sense, it interupts the power from the ecu to switch the F/P relay on.

I suspect that is your issue.
__________________
[CENTER][SIGPIC][/SIGPIC][/CENTER]
[CENTER][COLOR=#ff0000]Built Ej207: Semi-closed RA Cases - Wiseco Forgies - Manley rods - BC 272 cams - GDA Heads - billet f/whl - Vi-pec - WbO2 - 800cc Yellow tops - TD05-20G - 409Hp ath @ 1.75bar on E85[/COLOR][/CENTER]
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 21-09-2010, 11:20 AM
Potty Training Scoobie Noobie
Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: perth
Posts: 35
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
BLKGC8 at standard level
Default

Sorry i meant the key pad module, not the key pad. And the modules are usualy either under the dash, behind the glove box or under your heater controls. They are about $120 from a dealer ship.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 21-09-2010, 06:10 PM
Potty Training Scoobie Noobie
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Bunbury
Posts: 55
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
VETTETOREX at standard level
Default

Thanks for your replies.

When I had a chance throughout the day I kept flipping the switch to on several times (which seemed to work for some others on other forums) and
presto the fuel pump fired up, started as normal and drove perfectly fine. Then it would prime as normal when I flipped the switch.

What seemed weird was the blue relay got quite warm for some reason like maybe fuel pump pulling too many amps or something. Is this normal?

Then I left for an hour and then back to nothing. Doh.

I'm still not 100% sure that the blue relay is the fuel pump and what is the pink relay for?

It is probably the Brant playing up so I presume this means a tow to Subaru if I can't find an obvious cause soon without pulling half the interior apart.

Hopefully they can sort it out for not too many $$$$ if the techs know there stuff (Bunbury Subaru). It's the last thing I want to do but it's already half pulled apart for them. I will try to locate the Brant module and see if anything is obvious like solder joints but I don't want to make things worse if it's not the Brant at fault.

Possibly fuel pump on it's way out, hence the relay getting hot and maybe melting a plug or wires somewhere?

Any further advice would be great, the Brant is beyond me, especially considering the 3 button is screwed and only works once out of every 20 or so soft presses. (Still managed to get the code in every time I had to but I'm too scared to disconnect battery and reset ECU which probably wouldn't help anyway)
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 21-09-2010, 06:16 PM
Potty Training Scoobie Noobie
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Bunbury
Posts: 55
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
VETTETOREX at standard level
Default

Also, If I want to jump the fuel pump with 12v to test, is it fine to place + on the red/black wire and - on the black. I'm 95% positive but don't want to bust fuel level/pressure sensors or anything if its the wrong wires. And anyway I should be getting 12V on the Black/red wire for the first few seconds anyway so why bother right? Just being very cautious.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 21-09-2010, 06:18 PM
Addy's Avatar
Sign me up!
Santa's Little Helper
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Como
Posts: 338
Thanks: 6
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
Addy at standard level
Default

Just from reading how you got it started sounds like 99% brant issue to me just from experience with a particular Brant issue.

Adi
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 21-09-2010, 06:37 PM
Rossco's Avatar
Perth WRX Old Skool Cool Dude
Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Perf, NOR
Posts: 5,467
Blog Entries: 11
Thanks: 54
Thanked 100 Times in 79 Posts
Rossco is a guruRossco is a guru
Send a message via MSN to Rossco
Default

If you suspect it's the fuel pump try this:

With someone cranking the car, tap the top to the fuel tank module (moderate blows) with a rubber mallet (or similar) if the car starts your fuel pump is shagged.

What year is your car & how many kays on it?
__________________
[CENTER][SIGPIC][/SIGPIC][/CENTER]
[CENTER][COLOR=#ff0000]Built Ej207: Semi-closed RA Cases - Wiseco Forgies - Manley rods - BC 272 cams - GDA Heads - billet f/whl - Vi-pec - WbO2 - 800cc Yellow tops - TD05-20G - 409Hp ath @ 1.75bar on E85[/COLOR][/CENTER]
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 21-09-2010, 07:39 PM
Potty Training Scoobie Noobie
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Bunbury
Posts: 55
Thanks: 0
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
VETTETOREX at standard level
Default

Thanks, I already tried tapping it a bit already with the end of a rubber handled screwdriver. I wanted to hit it with 12V just to hear the pump but thought of the 5% chance I have the wrong pins I might stuff up the sensors.

The car drove great once I got it started and I thought even if the fuel pump was knackered I should still be able to 12v at the harness at key on even if only for a few seconds. Just making sure I was checking the right wires. (Two thicker ones on the far right of plug on top and bottom,one earths to ground (Black) other is black/red (+?) The other 3 are thin wires which i assume to be Fuel level, Tank pressure etc)

Makes sense to me that the two thick wires are the pump, but as we all know assuming things all the time always leads to stuff ups without being 100% sure of what you're doing. (In my case anyway)

Car is a July 2000 MY00, with 190,000km in good and clean condition. Probably time for a Walbro but I have had no issues at any RPM (and it just drove fine before) and I don't flog it. A few pulls in 2nd to the highway speed limit is about it most the time and its always smooth and enjoyable.

I was hoping it was something simple like a relay or fuse at first but the Brant is a whole new ball game for me. I never liked since I first encountered Anti-hijack mode after buying from a car yard then later that day taking my seatbelt off and opening my door to get something then later down the road I was like What the hell? Then later when disconnecting the battery to change the spark plugs, lucky I had the master code written in the Brant manual, which isn't the first thing you read when you buy car.

It's all live and learn but can be frustrating at first.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
fuel, priming, pump, start

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Spec C Fuel Pump urabus Mechanicals 31 25-03-2009 07:15 PM
F.S Highly modified 2004 STI-526 hp atw on pump fuel trainwrex For Sale (Cars Only) 1 29-04-2008 08:32 AM
Bosch 910 Elrico Mechanicals 28 27-05-2007 11:19 AM
Fuel Pump for Verso Tune gumby General Subaru Discussion 32 25-04-2007 03:01 PM
fuel pump problem Carnivore General Subaru Discussion 4 11-07-2006 04:30 PM



Welcome to Perth-WRX, click here to register!

All times are GMT +8. The time now is 04:47 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO