Stumped about DSLR choice
 

Hey guys

Ive been looking for months now for a new camera and I have only been a P&S boy. I have decided to take the plunge and go into the DSLR game after looking at all the stunning shots from you guys.

I was set on going out and buying a Pentax K200D during the week from JB's (as I have a $553 gift card) but then I was advised by a work mate that I should be looking at a Nikon so we can share lenses.

He has a D80 and I noticed that around the price range of under $1000 the Nikons, both D40 and D60, dont have the AF motor built into the camera so I wouldnt be able to share the lens I would need for my camera with my mates.

The D80 is still around $1,200 with only a single lens kit plus the D80 is old now and has been replaced by the D90 which I think is way over priced ($1799 for a single lens kit).

After reading a bit here on the forums and also a lot of other reviews the better option would be to go for a 450D if I was spending the "over $1200" mark.

I just checked out a link that someone provided for Camera's Direct when looking for a 450D and they have the Canon 40D for $1,125 (Body Only) and the Canon 40D w/ 18-55mm kit for $1,347. [url]https://www.camerasdirect.com.au/index.php/cameras/dslr-cameras/canon/eos-40d.html[/url]

Also, if I went body only is there a particular zoom which is a "legendary" zoom which will last me for years and years and still under $500?

How much better is the 40D over the other camera's I mentioned and is that a good option to go with or should I just stick to the original plan for K200D since I am only learning and save my pennies for later down the track?

Thanks for your help.

jase

Have you looked at buying the body only D90 camera and then getting a secondhand lens later on. If your friend was nice enough he could let you borrow one of his lenses until you have enough money to buy one of your own?

Get a canon. They are great, plus more people have Canons therefore more chances of sharing lenses.

I assume since you have the gift card you will by the body from JB, however start watching [url]www.qcsa.com.au[/url] for lenses.

450d twin lens kit go for it. good value.

i was stumped for choice too, bought it, happy as. good value. try and find a good deal, and then get myers or david jones to price match, then get someones discount card if u can.


my twin lens kit 450d cost me 1150! awesome as

There is a guy on Antilag selling a lightly used 40D with 17-85 lens for $1300 ono

sleepy here is selling his 400d with lens and some other parts for 650. Good starting point imo

have a look at this guys opinions:

[url]http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/recommended-cameras.htm[/url]

he basically says buy a cheap nikon d40 and a sweet lens and you will be happier than if you got the d80 for the same money with a shit one. and that the d40 will do everything you need and be lighter and easier to carry around.

probably good advice to be honest. once you've gotten your practice with a cheap d40 you might be in a position to know what you really want.

at the end of the day your committing to a group of lenses.

this is why i bought the pentax k20d, because it has in body stabilisation and that saves me a lot of $. (that and i like the weather seals)

don't think megapixies mate...investing in awesome glass is more important!!!

did you guys know you can use nikon glass on canon cameras?

[url]http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/B0001PNLBO/kenrockwellcom[/url]

but not the other way round.

I've been through a couple of Dslr's.

I started off with an Olympus E-300, then a Canon 40d and now a Nikon D60.

The Nikon, to me at least, is the best one I've owned so far.

Fastest cold start speed, fast auto focus, 4 fps shooting, uses sd or sdhd cards (cheaper than compact flash), has in lens image stabilization. can be used P & S style as you learn how to use it or fully manual.

I bought the twin IS lens kit with mine and love the kit glass. they're pretty fast on focus, so is the 40d but I found the 40d would 'hunt' for the correct focus from time to time adding lag to shots of moving objects (like cars @ Barbs).

Yeah my friend at work has only just started mucking around with DSLR and he has only one lens at the moment... but will be getting more (hopefully) soon.

Its such a tough decision.

My main aim is to have a camera that would take the best night time shots as this is really the only spare time I would have. I will be taking some day time shots on the weekends. I want to do events and gigs etc.

Also, the less noise at night is paramount. And shots have to be sharp and the colours punchy.

Prime lenses are great for night shots. Cheap too, can get an F1.8 50mm Canon prime lens for around $130.

You need to think of the body almost as if it is a consumable. I.e. unless you damage them you will have your lense for a hell of lot longer than any body. They are a bit like your PC at home. By the time you get it home there is a new model out. The same can not be said for lenses.

As per what other people have said buy the absolute best lenses you can afford and then update the body when / as you can afford it.

Also remember that the the lenses are not going to depreciate like the body will.

Unless your mates have some really good lenses I would go and buy the system that you like best.

Brendon

[QUOTE=werticusness]have a look at this guys opinions:

[url]http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/recommended-cameras.htm[/url]

he basically says buy a cheap nikon d40 and a sweet lens and you will be happier than if you got the d80 for the same money with a shit one. and that the d40 will do everything you need and be lighter and easier to carry around.

probably good advice to be honest. once you've gotten your practice with a cheap d40 you might be in a position to know what you really want.

at the end of the day your committing to a group of lenses.

this is why i bought the pentax k20d, because it has in body stabilisation and that saves me a lot of $. (that and i like the weather seals)[/QUOTE]


Ken Rockwell is the biggest clown on the internet haha

I would stick to Canon Both nikon and Canon Are great but Value for money the canon will come through.

Buy the right lens to start with and you will have them for years.
No point wasting money on what people call a Starting Learning lens, becuase u wont get the true capabilitys of what you can produce and have to buy a better one later anyway.

Stick to f2.8 and L series lens and they will be by your side for years to come and you can just upgrade body.

I would go for a 5d or 5d mk2 stright off. Dont waste your time going anything less if you plan on doing weddings and gigs like you mentioned. Becuase they wont perform in low light and you just spending money for nothing.

Get the best of what you can afford and play with it with in 6 months you will be shooting events and all.

on another note I woudlnt wait for people to upgrade Becuase if you buy the right lens to start with you dont need to upgrade.

I would recomend

24-70 F2.8 L about $2000
70-200 F2.8 IS L about $2700

a 580ex II Flash $550

and a good Tripod $200-350 mark

You can pick up a 5D for $1800 or there abouts now days.
and a mk2 for about $3900.

Think of it all as a investment though.

I Have bought other lens before cheaper ones and then regret it becuase they dont perform how i need them to So I have learnt to get the right stuff from the start now. Lens specially.

Agree with Tim, If your gonna shoot events and Gigs low noise is very important and a Full Frame Camera is the best choice, Have you been shooting for long? because jumping straight in saying you want to shoot gigs is a big step haha, If you want to do that and make money then you should get the proper gear.

Yes on that note 5D was rated one of the best cameras for Noise in low light too.

I shot a microsoft gig at the convention centre went from 7am to 10pm all day
I used the 5d and 24-70 and 70-200 those rooms were dark so the 2.8 i needed to focus as well. and i needed images to come out good from the camera as i didnt have much time to edit as i was feeding them from lightroom quick edit then up to the plasma screens around the expo .

Whatever your final choice regards brand, body and lenses, LEARN HOW TO USE A DSLR! There are as many differences with a P&S as there are similarities. RTFM many times over to get the most outta your DSLR, check google for good photography sites, even do a basic photography course which focuses on SLR (pardon the pun) if time & $$$ permit.

This way, you won't be someone who keeps the dial on Auto setting, hoping for the camera to do all the work, and never realising the full potential that an SLR has to offer.

[QUOTE=westoz]Whatever your final choice regards brand, body and lenses, LEARN HOW TO USE A DSLR! There are as many differences with a P&S as there are similarities. RTFM many times over to get the most outta your DSLR, check google for good photography sites, even do a basic photography course which focuses on SLR (pardon the pun) if time & $$$ permit.

This way, you won't be someone who keeps the dial on Auto setting, hoping for the camera to do all the work, and never realising the full potential that an SLR has to offer.[/QUOTE]

Really fcuking scary that sort of stuff happens!!!

As for cams, everybody is going to recommend their fave brand...you need to go with what you think is best (brand wise) and choose something within your budget.

My recomendation would be a D80 and the 18-200 VR lens. The d80 is fairly cheap now and is a good camera. The 18-200 lens is good value for money and works fairly well in low light...it is also a versatile bit of kit. As people have said, get a prime ~f1.8 and a cam that does well with high ISO stuff if you're serious about shooting gigs!

Lastly, why is Ken Rockwell a knob...he seems to be fairly successful at what he does! He seems to have a decent fan base and fairly well respected from what I can see! Just curious?

[QUOTE=agentorange]My recomendation would be a D80 and the 18-200 VR lens. [/QUOTE]My exact setup currently [img]http://www.perth-wrx.com/vb/images/smilies/biggrin.gif[/img]

Also go for an RF remote (not IR) like [url="http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Mega-Cleon-Wireless-Remote-N6-for-Nikon-D70s-D80-N2_W0QQitemZ120372989926QQcmdZViewItemQQptZAU_Cameras_Photographic_Accessories?hash=item120372989926&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=66%3A4%7C65%3A1%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318"]this one[/url] which has a hot shoe mount for the receiver and 100M range on the transmitter. While on eBay, look for a tripod, decent ones can be had for under $100. Both items are essential for night shots.

I shoot a lot of events and use a 5D and 24-70 mostly. I started with a 30D and 17-40 and found the going hard. IS doesnt really come in to it at gigs as it may stop your camera shake, but wont stop your subject from motion blurring. IS is more handy at the longer focal lengths.

To be honest, you need as much help as you can get in the low light. Therefore good low light body such as d700, d3, 5D, 1D are really the go if you want to be selling shots. You might get away with a 50D or d300. Primes are great for low light but can be restrictive when you have limited vantage points. You dont want to be swapping lenses amongst the crowd. f2.8 zooms are the go, dont settle for a f4. f2.8 is twice the amount of light as f4.

All this is irrelevant anyway if you dont understand the fundamentals of photography. Its an expensive hobby so you should try and limit your upgrades as much as possible.

Got myself a Canon 450D SLR Twin lens kit for around $1350 from JB HiFi.

Amazing camera!! Can't go wrong with Canon.

Just ordered a 50mm f1.4 prime... bargain price (300ish) for what is supposed to be one of the best lens and a 'must' own for any pentax owner.

[img]http://www.photomalaysia.com/reviews/data/14/Pentax-FA50mmF14.jpg[/img]

This will be my first decent lens, I've always had basically crap ones still now.

Nice! your gonna love it hey, primes ftw!

how about a lecia s2 37mp :)

[url]http://www.dpreview.com/news/0809/08092301_leica_s2.asp[/url]

was hell excited when I read about the s2 and then saw the price tag haha.

Is there a price floating around or is it just rumours? 30k is what I hear.

says 20,000 euros here, I rekon would be around 30k Aus, Somwhere inbetween highest spec DSLRs and bit cheaper then the digital medium formats.

[url]http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1038&message=29436149[/url]

Anyone heard anything good about:

Tamron AF 18-250mm f/3.5-6.3 XR Di II lens

Sigma 18-200mm F3.5-6.3 DC OS

vs Canon and Nikon 18-200mm lenses?

I heard that the standard twin lens kits that are selling cheap these days are not that good. The lenses above are cheaper or as cheap as the Canon and Nikon equivalent 18-200 lenses.

i try and stay away from any lens that has the Fstop range changing. at the end of the day your quality is going to be sticking with Canon or nikon made Lens.

You want to get fixed apature lens

[QUOTE=NVRENUF]i try and stay away from any lens that has the Fstop range changing. at the end of the day your quality is going to be sticking with Canon or nikon made Lens.

You want to get fixed apature lens[/QUOTE]

How does this ultimately affect quality though?

I was under the impression that Tamron (maybe not Sigma) is better then Canon/Nikon made equivalents.

I imagine if you have a lens which changes Fstops are you are zooming, you will need to adjust the aperture on the camera to the suitable setting manually....I could see this may get annoying.

Reason I am thinking of a single wide range lens is for travelling (which I do both for work & rec). More lenses = more weight/baggage and then the hassle of changing lenses for different shots.

[QUOTE=fmx_rider]How does this ultimately affect quality though?

I was under the impression that Tamron (maybe not Sigma) is better then Canon/Nikon made equivalents.

I imagine if you have a lens which changes Fstops are you are zooming, you will need to adjust the aperture on the camera to the suitable setting manually....I could see this may get annoying.

Reason I am thinking of a single wide range lens is for travelling (which I do both for work & rec). More lenses = more weight/baggage and then the hassle of changing lenses for different shots.[/QUOTE]


with a fixed Apature lens images are sharper, Faster focusing, genine made lens are better quality i find. I have sigma and canon lens and find my canon lens are much better image.

The best images i get are from my 70-200 f2.8 is lens even more so than my 24-70

Do you stop it down to f/4 at all Tim for better shots?

[QUOTE=NVRENUF].

The best images i get are from my 70-200 f2.8 is lens even more so than my 24-70[/QUOTE]

i have both and can't tell the difference :) 2 of the best lenses i reckon

here is a lot of reviews:

[url]http://www.photozone.de/Reviews/overview[/url]

open up tabs on competing lenses and check out their sharpness and CA levels etc. Then factor in the price and your off :P

I've been reading reviews all day for the last week or so... got about 6 pages of notes and at the moment I want the:

Sigma 10-20mm wide ($800) or tamron 10-24 its a choice between better ca or better distortion....

Sigma 24-70 f2.8 ($785)
and Tamron 70-200 f2.8 (1180)

All these are better, in every review I can find, than Pentax or nikon equivalent. Canon lenses seem to do better in quality tests and these only equal them. All are far cheaper, some half some more than half price.

Its not cut and dry however, I've seen duds from every maker of lenses and it might even be on a review by review basis if they had a bad lens. For example the 70-200f2.8 sigma is very good, but the 70-200f2.8 sigma with HSM 2 motor is shite :P

but until i buy it ill keep researching.

Yeah of course, I dont always shoot at 2.8 thats not what im saying but regardless of what f stop your shooting at when you focus and its looking for light its using the 2.8 to let the light in and it only sees f4 when i press the shutter down

So until you take the photo it is letting the light in at 2.8 to help focus etc, But as soon as the shutter goes F4,

[QUOTE=pete gopal]i have both and can't tell the difference :) 2 of the best lenses i reckon[/QUOTE]


Defiently Love those lens. the main two I use all the time

[QUOTE=fmx_rider]
I was under the impression that Tamron (maybe not Sigma) is better then Canon/Nikon made equivalents.[/QUOTE]
ROFL not really. Cheaper though.

[QUOTE=fmx_rider]
Reason I am thinking of a single wide range lens is for travelling (which I do both for work & rec). More lenses = more weight/baggage and then the hassle of changing lenses for different shots.[/QUOTE]
Its a bit of a case of jack of all trades, master of none. You wont really be changing from your wide angle zoom much unless you go to like a zoo or something where you might need a longer zoom. 95% if the time you will be shooting in that 10-35mm range (on crop body). If your going to europe you will want the widest lens available for the laneways and interiors.

problem with a lens with that much focal zoom is that lenses have sweet spots of sharpness, they arnt the same sharpness over the whole focal length so when you have a lens that goes from 18-200mm the sweet spots are gonna be smaller so generally you wont get the best I.Q. and thats why Primes are sharp as a tack :D

[QUOTE=slappy]ROFL not really. Cheaper though.

[QUOTE]

That was only for equivalent 18-200/18-250 lenses, not all lenses in general...which most reviews I have read support.