As the vehicle operator you ARE responisble for incorrectly adjusted headlamps/ blown tail lamp globes etc......As the driver it's you responsibility to check the vehicle for defective lamps.

Everyone knows to dip their highbeam when another car approaches......without being told continuosly.

No, but you will be put off the road and in give the inconvenience of visiting the pits.

Foglights reflect off the road surface dazzling on comming traffic when used on a dry road surface/clear night.......It is dangerous especially on country roads when you are approaching another vehicle head on at a combined 220 kmp/h and have been driving in complete darkness for hours.

You have to look away to avoid being temporarily blinded by the foglamp glare....not good! (the current crop of holden commodores are the worst)

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back to kindy for you MORON!



my comment, if you had a brain, you would understand this, was relating to your suggestion that...

SUBARU should be held responsible/be liable for you getting an infringement.



I can never understand these youngsters...

they make a post without thinking about what are writting...

and then they become abusive when you point out the error of their ways.



this forum does not need members like you.



that is all.

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AWDmoke- Consider my statement again: "To enforce a law and hold others accountable for it, they have to first have some knowledge of the law."

This statement has nothing to do with people being exempt from them, it is outlining the responsibility law makers and enforcers have to the public.
I totally agree based on your examples it is possible to discover you have broken a law without knowing it- but isn't this generally the exception to the rule in our society? (Eg- you aren't suggesting that all laws should remain discrete/ hidden and it's just 'bad luck' if/as one breaks them? This would be grossly unfair).


This is one of the points I am raising here: manufacturers currently DO NOT mention anything re: use of fog lamps and state laws etc. I do not believe they are to be held totally accountable (as others have suggested I am implying), but I think reasonable duty of care should be upheld in the same way that any other manufacturer adheres to with respect to laws/ safety (eg- Makita power tools will contain suggestions/ cautions for use... yet they are not responsible if you damage your eye sight/ cut off a hand etc. So why do it then? Because you show duty of care to your customers).

If one really wishes to address this issue then targeting one particular party isn't going to do it, everyone holds some responsibility here. 'Gorotsuki' makes a good argument- a lot of weight rests on govt and the process of setting laws into place, but I don't believe manufacturers are above the law either (as much as their lawyers attempt to brainwash us to think otherwise) and therefore have some responsibility to raise awareness that their own product sold on the vehicle is actually illegal to operate... especially seeing as this issue has existed for at least 15yrs or more!!?

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"...even my Grandma can drive fast in a straight line"

I perfectly understood what u said mate.
And my point is genuine people go on a forum to ask others for help and u get dicheads like you who get all nasty...and over what?
Grow up mate.

I'm amazed at the attitudes that get displayed on forums. Lack of empathy leads to moments like this:

High-beam teen driver 'threatened with gun'

A man threatened a teenage driver with a shotgun after she mistakenly drove with her headlights on high beam in the NSW Hunter Valley.

The 17-year-old girl was unaware she had her headlights on high beam as she was driving on Aberglasslyn Rd, Rutherford, about 10.20pm (AEDT) on Saturday.

Police say the ute driver in front of her changed lanes and began following her car, before they both pulled over to the side of the road.

"It's alleged he exchanged words with her two passengers, produced a firearm and pointed it at each of the occupants, repeatedly sliding the pump-action loader," police said in a statement.

The man then drove off and police were called to the scene.

Officers later arrested an 18-year-old man at a home in Avery St, Rutherford, and charged him with offences including using an offensive weapon with intent to commit an indictable offence.

He is due to appear in Maitland Local Court on March 1.


http://news.ninemsn.com.au//national...th-replica-gun

From Australian Road Rules - Feb 2009

Rule 217
Using fog lights
(1) The driver of a vehicle fitted with front fog lights or rear fog
lights must not operate the fog light unless the driver is
driving in fog or other hazardous weather conditions causing
reduced visibility.
Offence provision.
(2) In this rule:
front fog light means a light (other than a headlight) fitted
to the front of a vehicle to improve illumination of the road
in fog, snowfall, heavy rain or dust clouds.
rear fog light means a light (other than a brake light, a tail
light, a number plate light or a reversing light) fitted to the
rear of a vehicle to make the vehicle more easily visible
from the rear in fog, snowfall, heavy rain or dust clouds

Hey buddy, I've read through this 2-3 times and while I see the point you're trying to make about some motorists finding fog lights too bright etc, reducing this argument to the basis of fear- that somehow we're responsible for someone else's rage to the point that they have intent to kill- it doesn't really address the points being made here, do you think?

To recap:
* Is there a grey area re: these 'laws' the has been catching people out for 15yrs or so?- yes (hence the title of this thread)
* Am I responsible to uphold fog lamp laws?- yes
* Is the government responsible to raise more awareness on these laws?- yes
* Do manufacturers share some responsibility in raising awareness re: safe operation of their products concerning the laws?- yes

Am I responsible for a guy pointing a gun at me if I forget to dim my lights/ leave fog lamps on...? You see my problem here...

It's not a "lack of empathy that leads to moments like this", it's people taking the law into their own hands because they're not objective enough and can't take responsibility for their own anger. "She made me do it" just doesn't hold up in court so well these days.

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"...even my Grandma can drive fast in a straight line"

seems pretty black and white to me

buy a pair of fog light covers

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Long live the WRC

To you...
Clearly not everyone is as crystal on the matter mate.

In comparison, if I started a thread "is it illegal to speed?", it would be a different story. We both know why.

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"...even my Grandma can drive fast in a straight line"