Chrysler gets free money, thanks america - Page 3 - Perth-WRX.com

phizzle · #21 24-01-2009, 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LegacyRS

KRudd
Me @ Kirabilly, who'd have thought!

Farken LOL, too good Ross

dtrally · #22 25-01-2009, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LegacyRS

How would GMH handle having their supply of US built & supplied engines, trans, rear axles fall apart ?

Piece of piss mate. Dig up the dies from the fishermans' bend backyard for the Black 202 (best engine ever

) the Trimatic (donk-O-matic) and the banjo (bang-go) diff and start making 'world class' cars again...lol.

Rossco · #23 25-01-2009, 08:45 PM

Ah yes Traumatics......Speaking of Holden 'world class' cars, maybe the Camira will make a come back (if they can afford to buy the rights back from Daewoo), the fantastic piece of engineering they were.

the kiwi · #24 26-01-2009, 06:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LegacyRS

Missing the big picture ?

Tree works like this:

As an educated guess (being a parts interpreter in automotive for 16 years), I would say there is about 1,700 - 2,200 parts in the average vehicle.

For each part there is a company supplying each specific part to the manufacturer.

Lets use a generic Holden as an example.

Bosch (world wide multiple divisions): alternator, starter, engine management sensors, body control electronics, fan speed resistor, all relays, globes etc
Ac Delco (parent company for 2500+ part manufacturers): ECU, coil pack, trans control module, map sensor etc, fuel pump, injectors, battery, radiator, condenser, a/c evaporator, a/c blower motor.

GM Transmission div (US based): Auto trans assembly (using multiple part suppliers) and supplying 50% of auto trans world wide to manufacturers world wide (even Bentley!).

SKF bearings: various engine/driveline bearings
NTN bearings: various engine/driveline bearings

Just to name a few off the top of my head.......

This all filters down to the raw material suppliers be it for steel, alumina, rubber or silicone etc.......

The knock on effect of the top of the food chain (holden in this example) falling by the way side is huge if you take into account we export Iron Ore, Alumina, Nickel, lead, gold etc world wide and that we all know of someone who is in mining or mining's supporting infrastucture....

I hope there's not too many more 'safety' meetings (how ravensthorpe immidiate closure was anounced to staff on shift!!) being planned for mine sites in W.a

If those top three were to fail we'd be fucked plain and simple.

But they're not the only ones to be feeling it........Honda & toyota out of F1? just a rumour?
WRC farce?
Asian raw exports from Aus being halved?.. already happening people!

C'mon people the world economy is slowing not just the US!

Gah, how about your own personal interest taking the corporate lines; hook, line and sinker.

i cant claim 15 years experience in anything, but my 2 years working in my parents garage after school taught me a few things about the car industry.

mainly, the end blokes may sfa on parts and labour, its the manufacturers and suppliers who make the money.

off the bat, bosch ( http://www.bosch.com/content/language2/html/3283.htm ) is more than just dependant on the car industries so im going to assume that your other examples are just as shallow.

the hard truth is. GM may fold, profitable parts will be sold of to other companies and will continue to exist. parts will be need and as such 3rd party parts manufacturers will eventually create their own.

car themselves will be continue to be required. As such they will be built. poor quality will eventually scare of some buyers, however some people will always want 'cheapest'. However a few companies will survive because fleet requirements for larger companies will require strongly built vehicles. Toyota I believe could quite easily design and replace the commodore if it were to disappear.

However, I'm dribbling.
short version: Car industry primary manufacturers are in trouble. tuff titties. 3rd party manufacturers will develop the require parts if primary manufacturers cark it. sales people around the world are currently upset because it threatens their bonuses. People will still be employed, dead weight in companies should be on lookout, their jobs are not secure. joe blogs on corner garage will still be able to live as is current. holiday home may be on back burner for a while.

teejay · #25 26-01-2009, 09:27 PM

That massive cost to the American government to pay benefits to all those who would have lost their job, along with all those who would have lose their job due to the on-flow effect means its cheaper for them to bail them out then let them die.

P.S the pic isnt entirely correct, Ford have said several times they dont need the money, they can operate from their own pocket.

What they do need is the laws passed to reverse the old deals with the unions - the awesome retirement and health benefits is what threatens to bankrupt all 3 of them.

Rossco · #26 26-01-2009, 09:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by teejay

That massive cost to the American government to pay benefits to all those who would have lost their job, along with all those who would have lose their job due to the on-flow effect means its cheaper for them to bail them out then let them die.

P.S the pic isnt entirely correct, Ford have said several times they dont need the money, they can operate from their own pocket.

What they do need is the laws passed to reverse the old deals with the unions - the awesome retirement and health benefits is what threatens to bankrupt all 3 of them.

Exactly!

Rossco · #27 26-01-2009, 09:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the kiwi

Gah, how about your own personal interest taking the corporate lines; hook, line and sinker.

My own personal interest has nothing to do with it! I have management experience in industries a world apart from the Auto industry.

Quote:

Originally Posted by the kiwi

i cant claim 15 years experience in anything, but my 2 years working in my parents garage after school taught me a few things about the car industry.

You are aware then that 'garages' make ther money out of the labour and services they provide not the markup on parts (usually 10 - 20%). If not you do now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by the kiwi

mainly, the end blokes may sfa on parts and labour, its the manufacturers and suppliers who make the money.

Very true as a supplier a 20% less than retail price for my cost is fuck all, then we give trade 10% off retail aswell. We work on volume of sales not sales value.

You are wrong about the labour though bcause if you'e charging the customer $75 per hour and paying your mech $25 per hour...There's $50 per hour going straight to the bank..... Labour is where it's at.

i.e $200 in parts for a timing belt change and $1800 labour to do it.

And just for the record, Most of my time is spent dealing with Porsche & Bentley......Both of whome are fine, Porsche having 5 model releases still planned for 2009.

Kato · #28 27-01-2009, 07:29 AM

I do love how you seem to want to defend this all the time.

What if it was Ford, Daewoo, Lada or another company who couldn't afford to run their business? What happens in 6 months when these businesses that couldn't manage their own money in the first place have blown through their free government money?

Other car manufactures seem to be able to make money and be profitable. As per my original point, its a business, if you can't hack it too bad.

teejay · #29 27-01-2009, 10:36 AM

John, in most cases I'd agree - cant make it work, then good bye.

The problem is the impact the closure of these 3 little companies would have on the world economy would be substantial. Think the American economy is screwed now.. well id hate to see it if they went under.

So they are chosing the lesser of two evils by propping these guys up.

Hopefully the new laws, and serious restructuring can sort them out. Might even end up making some good cars.

Kato · #30 27-01-2009, 12:10 PM

Yeah I hope they sort themselves out.

Problem I see is like the cash payments handed out in Aus last year. Props the economy up for a couple of weeks and then it is gone. If these companies couldn't handle their money properly in the first place, I hope they have new people looking after it now.